Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

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Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby Balthasar Katharsis on Mon Apr 02, 2012 3:15 pm

Please find the he following statement on TJ.NET. Please find there also a first excerpt of TurboLeaks (http://www.turbojugend.net/DeathpunkMoonshiners.pdf):

The Turbojugend started in the late nineties as Turbonegro's Navy. In more than a decade, the Jugend fostered not only the myth of the band but established a common sense for like-minded individuals, manifested in a lifestyle and friendships all over the world. In particular friendship has been the spirit of the Turbojugend from the beginning and this spirit has been essential to keep the Jugend alive. Among other chapters, Turbojugend St. Pauli has cultivated this friendship.

Confronted with the Deathpunk Moonshiners, we see this spirit violated and are concerned about the future. Despite being a small online group, the Deathpunk Moonshiners presume to redefine the Turbojugend by neglecting its complex structure that has evolved over time. Persons who discuss how to "gain control", announce TURBOJUGEND".NET will be dead" and plan "little underhanded computer work" to get the Turbojugend database might misinterpret the Jugend as a gang and have lost any sense of decency.

In particular, we are worried about the illegal activities announced by the Deathpunk Moonshiners (please find an excerpt from their discussion on http://www.turbojugend.net/DeathpunkMoonshiners.pdf). As we are concerned about your private data, we have removed TURBOJUGEND.NET from the Internet. TURBOJUGEND.NET might lack state-of-the-art features but this site is still popular and heavily used. We are sad about the removal, but we see this as our only chance to protect your (!) data from the Deathpunk Moonshiners.

TURBOJUGEND.NET has always relied on the contribution from various chapters and has been always welcome for suggestions and pro-bono support. Thus, we are interested in your opinion. How do you see the future of the Turbojugend and TURBOJUGEND.NET? Please feel free to join the discussion on Facebook.

Balthasar Katharsis (TJ St. Pauli) and
Santanico Pandemonium (TJ St. Pauli)
on behalf of TURBOJUGEND.NET
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Re: Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby Paul von Rotten on Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:25 pm

I don't know what is going on with this but I am absolutely floored that the chapter I co-founded and presided over for five years was mentioned in that excerpt. Someone needs to seriously check themselves.
Last edited by Paul von Rotten on Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby Reverend_Rauchzart on Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:32 pm

What started the problem? People want Kutten, and nothing happened. Too many unanswered e-mails etc. So people started to take matters into their own hands. The hacking thing sounds really bad, but I understand that there is a cause for a revolution. I hope this restarts a discussion that will lead to a good solution which includes the Sankt Pauli chapter.

By the way: stealing that database is useless. That data is a few years old now. Many e-mail addresses will not exist anymore, just like 90% of the chapters. Even if the addresses still exist, people won't answer.
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Re: Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby Paul von Rotten on Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:02 pm

People "want" a lot of stuff. Usurping someone else's thing because they may be neglecting or misshandling it is still wrong. I don't condone any bootlegging of kuttes or undermining the flagship jugend or El Presidente in any way, shape or form.
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Re: Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby Chris Crusoe on Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:37 pm

Let me qoute myself from the facebook discussion...

I support anything the RUNS. I have to say, i don't really care, WHO puts order in it, monnshiners oder the mother herself. But my e-mails haven't been returned since a while. I am strongly PRO-TURBOJUGEND, I want to buy and pay more Kutten and I want to communicate with jugends, friends and family. If turbojugend.net keeps up the work they always put in with so much effort and love, I would be absolutley happy about it. We can all support the organization, if needed. If it goes on falling apart, as it seems to me since a while, I start to sew my own jackets by hand!

An add:
There are many people in the club twho have great abilites. We can all help run shops, forum, websites, we can also arrange to send in own jackets, if the production-process is such pain. But we need to have conversation about this, instead of unanswered e-mails, a homepage that gets updated every six monthes and so on...
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Re: Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby Chief Blitzkrieg Pauli on Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:07 pm

Word up Chris!
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Re: Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby Paul von Rotten on Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:32 pm

When I hear that the band say that jugend business and merch need to be handled differently I will totally be on board. I want better turn around on kuttes and jugend business as well. I don't think this is being handled appropriately though.
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Re: Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby Borneo Jimmy on Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:48 pm

Well, Chuck already wrote the moonshiners-idea in another topic here!

The "illigal private dates stealing" thing was thought as a joke i think. definitly not a good one, but i think it definitly was not thought serious!

Chris already said everything I think! I 100% agree his opinion! Nothing else to say!

But I wonder that suddenly everyone in Hamburg is pissed, even if I just saw one single person from St. Pauli on a Jugend happening outside Hamburg in the past few years...
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Re: Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby reverend of the almighty on Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:54 pm

This is the same statement that has been made on Facebook. Think about what I have said here, and understand that I make some jokes sometimes that do not go over well.

Let me be frank, and open, and clarify a couple things.

One, I am a believer in absolute honesty. I will take blame and fault where it may lay.

In November 2011, I spoke with El Presidente over the phone. I discussed with him his lack of involvement in WTJT. I discussed the moving of part of the Hamburg operation of Kutte distribution to the US. I also discussed with him the 'cleansing' or 'culling' of the chapters that are no long involved in the Turbojugend organization, which would involve contacting them, seeing if they still wish to be involved, and moving forward. During this call, I explained that there were many people waiting to order kuttes, and if something didn't happen, I felt the need to aide in their supply. After this phone call, I emailed him to ask about Balthazar's email, considering he had mentioned that he had the database of information in that regard. After that, I waited. I waited some more. And some more...

Both he and I, and quite a few others, had been involved in a group called the Deathpunk Record Store. This group's mentality was to help push and guide the process of making merchandise for Turbojugend members to enjoy, and help to foster a community setting in which we could find out about each other's chapter's bands, trade patches a bit easier, and enjoy each other's company.

After waiting about five months to receive an email about Kutte ordering, or Balthazar's email, I took El Presidente's lack of communication at his word. He had been tired of working on this, and exhausted of battling with manufacturing issues. So, rather than waiting any longer, I decided to get a couple jackets made. I had an old Levi's vest, and thought, "What the hell, I can toss the cap and rockers on it." I did it, let a couple people know, and watched as that group of interested parties grew and grew. Including Rune Rebellion and Tony Sylvester.

Let it be said, that at no point, would I ever wish to do any "underhanded computer work," nor would I push anyone to do such things. Someone had offered their assistance, and I said, something to the effect "Shit dude, you think you can make it easier?!" A certain comment was made in jest, taken out of context, and I apologize for making it. I can understand people's concern.

I hold nothing against El Presidente. I believe in the cause that he had helped foster years ago. I hold nothing against St. Pauli. Let them grow, and change, and enjoy a great football team. I hold issues against progress and growth. I am a believer in helping people with their problems, and improving life for all of us.

The Mail Order site has had it's issues for some time, and none of us can argue that truth. Am I the first one to vocalize it? No. I don't believe so. Many people have been upset about the length of time it takes to get a response, or their jackets. I understand that at a manufacturing level, it takes time. But an email does not. Something as simple as a confirmation, is very quick and simple. Especially when you consider that it is your business.

The jackets that I have made and sent out have been done with no intention towards profit. In fact, this first round, I spent an extra $60 US for shipping. This was not money that I even asked to be sent to me. Turbonegro has expressed no interest in a royalty payment from me on this, because they expect their fans to get their merchandise quickly and efficiently.

If any of you have anything that needs clarifying, please vocalize it to me. I will be open and honest to you about what may/ will be going on, and as such, will welcome your suggestions and ideas. The Turbojugend is about us. It's about us being together and having a community. It is not about being above anyone else, or being 'too cool' to talk to anyone. History is history, we can appreciate it, but there is no changing it. It's about us all loving and appreciating each other. I want a unified Turbojugend as much as everyone else.

On behalf of a guy who has enjoyed Deathpunk Tourism, met a load of great people, and had a load of fun all the way... and just wanted to get myself and a couple dudes some jackets,

Chuck Maple
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Re: Turbojugend - Quo vadis?

New postby MotörGoodHead on Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:07 pm

Chris Crusoe wrote:Let me qoute myself from the facebook discussion...

I support anything the RUNS. I have to say, i don't really care, WHO puts order in it, monnshiners oder the mother herself. But my e-mails haven't been returned since a while. I am strongly PRO-TURBOJUGEND, I want to buy and pay more Kutten and I want to communicate with jugends, friends and family. If turbojugend.net keeps up the work they always put in with so much effort and love, I would be absolutley happy about it. We can all support the organization, if needed. If it goes on falling apart, as it seems to me since a while, I start to sew my own jackets by hand!

An add:
There are many people in the club twho have great abilites. We can all help run shops, forum, websites, we can also arrange to send in own jackets, if the production-process is such pain. But we need to have conversation about this, instead of unanswered e-mails, a homepage that gets updated every six monthes and so on...


THIS!!!! 1000% :smt023
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